Heaven And Hell...Can You Feel It?
Posted on: 08/03/2015 01:37 AM
King_of_Glass
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Re: It's the 24th July Down Under
Posted on: 07/30/2015 08:35 PM
Hi S - The adapted lyrics to Dan's "Lonely People" was very cool. It's a perfect fit.
Say, if as the Bible says, one day in heaven is equal to a thousand years on earth, I wonder what length of time it has felt like to Dan his being in heaven for four years? Where's my calculator???
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Re: It's the 24th July Down Under
Posted on: 07/31/2015 12:06 AM
Well, KoG, my opinion is that Dan isn't very concerned about the "passage of time," anymore. It takes having one of these "tents" we currently meander around in, to be concerned about time and space. One of the verses I've been meditating on the last few days is, "My times are in Your hands," Psalms 31:15. No need to worry about the passage of time. God's got it ALL under control, and if I care to look, I can see His hand at work, concerning MY "times."
P.S. I'd loan you my calculator. But it's acting weird again. My dad gave it to me and he's been gone 30 years. So it's quite old. But I just love it and don't want to have to throw it away. I won't ever get another calculator from my Daddy.
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King_of_Glass
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Re: It's the 24th July Down Under
Posted on: 07/31/2015 01:02 PM
shastaWell, KoG, my opinion is that Dan isn't very concerned about the "passage of time," anymore. It takes having one of these "tents" we currently meander around in, to be concerned about time and space.
Yes, S, that's correct. Dan isn't concerned about the passage of time. Those who have passed from this life to the next are now experiencing eternity where time no longer exists. I was just curious what length of time four years in heaven would seem like from our earthly standpoint. Still haven't broke out the calculator to figure it myself though. Remember how expensive a simple calculator was in the early 70s?
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shasta
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Re: It's the 24th July Down Under
Posted on: 08/01/2015 01:09 AM
No, I actually do NOT remember how inexpensive a calculator was in the 1970's. I'm not numerical, but verbal. And the only calculator I've ever owned, was this one, given to me by my dad.
Physically, Dan's doesn't "feel" anything. We feel because we have bodies. Currently, that's not his state. However, his soul (mind, will & emotions) as well as his spirit are alive and well. How much in tune they are with such earthly matters as the passage of time or questions of space/place (teehee) I don't know.
I have a friend who died a number of years ago. He was hit in the head by a falling tree and he died on the operating table. His experiences with sights, sounds and overall well-being are vivid. He wanted to stay in heaven, but Jesus sent him back! Ross was disappointed that he couldn't stay in heaven, but he "obeyed." Thoughts, emotions, decision-making all seem to have been in tact and his to control.
As I reread your post, I realize you are looking at the amount of time Dan has spent in heaven, from an earthly perspective. If that's the perspective, then the question is: We've been without Dan for 4 years DOWN HERE. I wonder how that feels to him in heaven? Doncha think? Or am I splitting hairs?
Get out your calculator. I'm curious as to what the readout will be!
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King_of_Glass
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Re: It's the 24th July Down Under
Posted on: 08/01/2015 01:00 PM
S - I disagree concerning those who have passed on to the next life not feeling anything just because they no longer have their earthly bodies. In Luke 16:24, it states:
"And he [the rich man] cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus [the beggar], that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame."
After all, isn't that what Hades/Hell is all about ... feeling torment and separation both physically and spiritually? Conversely, those in Paradise/Heaven are experiencing total joy. And, surely if the rich man is requesting that Lazarus the beggar dip the tip of his finger in water, Lazarus would have been able to feel the water on his fingertip just like the rich man would have been able to feel the cool water on his tongue, no?
Regarding the other matter, if one day is equal to a thousand years to the Lord, then I say Dan's being in Heaven for these past four years has felt roughly like only 5 to 6 minutes to him based on my calculations. If anyone has a different answer, I welcome theirs!
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shasta
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Re: It's the 24th July Down Under
Posted on: 08/01/2015 03:23 PM
And a Good Morning to You, KoG! God is GOOD! Because I made a very difficult decision, I was home to receive a great blessing this morning; one of my classmates invited me to the fitness center, as her guest! I swam and swam in their saltwater pool, luxuriated in their hottub and then swam some more and just floated in that salt water! Took a long, hot shower, washed my hair and then she treated me to a fresh-made smoothie and fresh-baked blueberry scone! Oh, how I love scones!
I'll look up the verse this conversation has me meditating on. Revelation 6:9-11. You can read it yourself. Perhaps I'm pulling in a verse that creates confusion, and I DESPISE confusion. God is a God of order, after all. But nevertheless, I've been chewing on these verses and wondering what state of existence the people were in. It says they were "souls," not bodies. And yet they were given "long, flowing and festive white robes" and "souls" don't need to be clothed! They had voices, because they used them. But they were told to "rest and wait patiently a little while longer," and ALL parts of our triune beings (body, soul and spirit) need rest. Hmmm.
But you make good points! In I Thess. 4:13-18 we have the other verses I am thinking of. Again, you can read them yourself. For emphasis: those who are dead are really "asleep." During sleep, the physical senses operate. The mind and emotions function to a degree. Not so sure about the will. Not sure what the spirit is doing either. It's certainly available to influence from EITHER kindgom. (Actually I kinda like that misspelling!) I wonder what a "gom" is! But until the body is awakened, there isn't purposeful interaction with what's around us. Hmmm.
Five or 6 minutes. Hmmm. Time flies, especially when you're having FUN, and there's no better fun to be had than in the presence of God! I Cor. 2:9, "No eye has seen, no ear has heard, no mind has conceived what God has prepared for those who love Him." EEEEHAW!
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King_of_Glass
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Re: It's the 24th July Down Under
Posted on: 08/01/2015 04:21 PM
shastaIn I Thess. 4:13-18 we have the other verses I am thinking of. Again, you can read them yourself. For emphasis: those who are dead are really "asleep." During sleep, the physical senses operate. The mind and emotions function to a degree. Not so sure about the will. Not sure what the spirit is doing either. It's certainly available to influence from EITHER kindgom. (Actually I kinda like that misspelling!) I wonder what a "gom" is! But until the body is awakened, there isn't purposeful interaction with what's around us. Hmmm.
Good afternoon, S:
1 Thessalonians 4:13-18 first. It reads:
"13 But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope.
14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.
15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words."
These words are pertaining to the yet-to-come event known as the Rapture, correct? The mention of the word "asleep" is merely referring to those who have died which I know you know because you stated so. Anyway, I'm confused why you mention the verses above in reference to whether a departed person can feel in the next life. Perhaps you can clarify for me.
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King_of_Glass
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Re: It's the 24th July Down Under
Posted on: 08/01/2015 06:54 PM
S - Since the time of my previous posting on this thread, I have been studying what you posted. You said:
"In I Thess. 4:13-18 we have the other verses I am thinking of. Again, you can read them yourself. For emphasis: those who are dead are really "asleep." During sleep, the physical senses operate."
So, are you actually in agreement with me? Since you said that during sleep, the physical senses operate, it sounds like you are saying the departed (those who are "asleep") would, after all, have physical senses which the sense of touch/feeling is one of them.
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shasta
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Posts: 1643
Re: It's the 24th July Down Under
Posted on: 08/02/2015 12:48 AM
Clarification, schlarification - at this time of night, KoG? You're asking me to think and to clarify??? TeeHee.
Let me warn you about my mentality. I'm one of those people who associates everything with everything. Sometimes I accidentally pull in ideas that I end up tossing, because I realize later that they don't pertain. But I have to pull it ALL in, in order to weed out the non-pertainers. And I also will start from a place of complete contradiction in order to move towards agreement! A little something I learned about myself in 2001 during my counseling training.
So bear with me, please. Keep slapping me with new verses and questions. It will help me to formulate a cohesive theology on the subject! Do I agree or disagree? Tomorrow. I can barely see right now. I'm tired.
Oh! I can answer this: Yes, the physical senses operate. But without a body to respond and interact with the environment, they're rather in a dormant state, don't you think? I remember when my father was dying and I KNEW he was in discomfort. I learned too late that I should have been moving him around in bed, so his blood wouldn't settle in one area and cause bruising. The hospice nurse didn't tell me. So he knew he was in pain, even though he was in a coma. But he couldn't TELL me and he couldn't do anything about it himself.
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King_of_Glass
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Re: It's the 24th July Down Under
Posted on: 08/02/2015 03:24 AM
Hi S - I'm tired, too. It's 1:25 AM so I'll look for your reply on Sunday. I went to see a country music band - RICOCHET - this evening (Saturday) at the county fair. It was very good, but it got cut short due to rain. Good night/good morning!
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shasta
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Re: It's the 24th July Down Under
Posted on: 08/02/2015 01:30 PM
Brrrrrrrrrrrrrring! (That's the alarm clock going off! Are you awake yet, KoG?
The first thing zipping around in my head this morning is the Transfiguration, where Peter, James and John saw Moses and Elijah meet with Jesus on the mountaintop and they heard them talking. Matt. 17:1-8. Now Elijah never died, II Kings 2:11. The only other person I know of that this happened to was Enoch, Gen. 5:22 & Heb. 11:5, the faith chapter. Interesting is that Enoch lived 365 years, and we count 365 days in a year! Moses died without entering the Promised Land, because of his disobedience. But God buried him and even though they searched, the people could NOT find his body! Deut. 34:4-6.
So we've got examples of 2 people who hadn't walked the planet for thousands of years, appearing in bodily form. One had left this life supernaturally and the other, naturally.
Ecclesiastes 12:7 says our bodies are made of dirt and at death, our spirits leave the body and the body returns to the dirt it was made of. Blasted coffins foul up that natural process!!! I Cor. 5:3 says, that while living, we are able to be present with others, "in spirit," despite NOT being in their physical presence. I've experienced this many times.
Now here is the monkey wrench. I just LOVE monkey wrenches! They're big and ugly, but very strong! James 2:26 says that without the body we are, "lifeless," the same as faith without works is, "dead."
So, we will run these notions around in our little finite minds for awhile and see what comes next, eh?
I haven't checked out Bing, Bing, Bing, Ricochet Rabbit yet, but I will. Glad you enjoyed the concert. It's a huge disappointment to go to all the trouble of attending something like that and then NOT like it! I'm glad you got some rain. I'm sure you guys need it down there. Thunder and lightning woke me up, I don't know, 1 or 2 a.m. I'm sure we've got more fires burning now. It's overcast and hazy this morning. Temps are down, humidity is up. But the clouds are gonna burn off and it will get warm. Then we'll see how much is clouds and how much is smoke.
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King_of_Glass
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Re: It's the 24th July Down Under
Posted on: 08/02/2015 04:31 PM
shastaJames 2:26 says that without the body we are, "lifeless," the same as faith without works is, "dead."
Good afternoon S:
You quoted three different verses but didn't specifically tie them to why the sense of touch/feeling would be absent following death according to what you believe. As a matter of fact, one of the quotes, James 2:26, you quoted incorrectly. It's without the spirit that the body is lifeless as correctly quoted here:
"For as the body without the SPIRIT is dead, so faith without works is dead also."
You said the verse states that without the BODY we are lifeless. It actually is that without the SPIRIT (as pertaining to the body), we are lifeless. In other words, it is the spirit that is actually alive in each living person. When the spirit leaves the body (as what happens at the time of one's death), you and I as Christians believe each person's spirit goes to one of two places which is either heaven or hell. I contend all physical senses (sight, hearing, taste, smell and touch) continue on. You are contending that the sense of touch/feeling no longer exists without a body, correct?
Let's just look at this subject very simply. You said you had a friend who had a severe head injury and died. To quote you: "His experiences with sights, sounds and overall well-being are vivid. He wanted to stay in heaven, but Jesus sent him back!"
Okay, your friend went to heaven without his body, right? Yet, without a body you said he still experienced sights and sounds which are two of the five senses. Why then was he able to have this experience without a body? If your logic is: without a body one is not able to experience the sense of touch, why then as with your friend who died and went to heaven was he able to still have his senses of sight and hearing? As I had mentioned yesterday concerning the rich man and Lazarus the beggar, the rich man was asking for Lazarus to be permitted to dip his fingertip (the body part we use to touch/feel) in water and place it on the rich man's tongue (the body part we use for taste)?
Again (to follow your logic), without a body in the afterlife, a person loses the sense of touch/feeling yet you believe that without a body a person is able to retain the senses of sight and hearing.
WHAT??? How is that logical?
Okay, your turn, :)
Edited by King_of_Glass on 08/02/2015 04:33 PM
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shasta
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Posts: 1643
Re: It's the 24th July Down Under
Posted on: 08/02/2015 05:46 PM
Oh! This is getting to be FUN, KoG! Keep my wheels turning!
You are correct. I misquoted James 2:26. Thank you for setting me straight. Mornings, you know? Foggy brain is more like it.
Now a thought occurs to me; it's the body that enables us to interact with the environment around us, right? The senses are still active in the spirit, because it's the spirit that gives life. But I think, based on Ross' experience, that down here where time and space constrain us, without a body, we cannot interact. Time and space as we know it do not exist in heaven. Therefore, despite not having a body, we CAN interact with the environment of heaven. Hmmm.
No I didn't specifically link the verses to this discussion. But somehow I feel they pertain. It's just gonna take time and the Spirit of God to make the connections!
I forget how to bring in a quote from another post! How do you do that! I wanted to quote your explanation and question, "How is that logical?" Of course it wasn't the LEAST bit logical. But it took someone else, like you, to point out how I was reasoning, in order for me to see the fallacy! Thank you again!
I have no more offerings for now. Been watching Revival videos. Had some light rain, which was refreshing. Now the sun's trying to break through (like you're trying to break through my fuzzy thinking?) and dispel the clouds/smog. Keep trying!!!
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King_of_Glass
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Posts: 1745
Re: It's the 24th July Down Under
Posted on: 08/02/2015 07:34 PM
shastaOf course it wasn't the LEAST bit logical. But it took someone else, like you, to point out how I was reasoning, in order for me to see the fallacy! Thank you again!
S - I see an "f" word..."fallacy"! So, am I to assume I finally got through? I'm not sure because you also said at the very end of your posting to, "Keep trying!!!"
Please let it be the former, and hopefully, your latter comment is for future fallacies if any.
Edited by King_of_Glass on 08/02/2015 07:37 PM
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shasta
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Posts: 1643
Re: It's the 24th July Down Under
Posted on: 08/02/2015 10:32 PM
I'm about to go out for my evening walk, KoG. Too smokey to swim and too cool. Hopefully there isn't any ash in the air. Smoke from forest fires I can handle. But the ash? Nope.
No. I don't think you're done with me yet on this topic. You've convinced me on a point or two - proving that my argument thus far is wrong or at best, incomplete. You need to keep trying!!!
We need a new name for this. You choose and set it up.
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Re: Heaven And Hell...Can You Feel It?
Posted on: 08/03/2015 01:46 AM
Okay S - I copied our postings from the other thread. It doesn't look pretty, but it's all there. I'm going to delete all of my postings from the original thread since they're here now. You will need to do the same.
Really, the topic continues? I had the feeling it wasn't completely finished based on your saying, "Keep trying!!!"
Well, actually, you need to tell me what remains questionable in your mind.
Re: Heaven And Hell...Can You Feel It?
Posted on: 08/03/2015 12:09 PM
Morning, KoG. I can't see this morning. Got chewing gum in my eyes. And you want me to delete posts and then post? HA!
I'm a woman. EVERYthing is questionable - except what is questionable! And I have to go to work this a.m. Doing a special job for my departed friend's husband. He tells me he's not sure what needs to be cleaned. So he wants my advice. I should charge him consultant fees, eh??? TeeHee.
Anyhoo, I have 2 places I would personally like to explore before we leave the topic. One is Dan's ministry writings. I don't recall him saying anything on this particular, narrow topic: To Feel or Not to Feel; That is the Question! The other place is Matthew and Jesus' discourses on "the end."
But no time now. I gotta get the chewing gum outta my eyes.
Re: Heaven And Hell...Can You Feel It?
Posted on: 08/03/2015 10:01 PM
S - I'm just waiting for your question. By the way, they feel things in hell, wouldn't you agree? Torment and they have no physical body there yet they can feel. So, what is left to wonder in this area? By the way, where did you get the idea for what you believe. Where is it in the Scriptures?
Re: Heaven And Hell...Can You Feel It?
Posted on: 08/03/2015 11:25 PM
KoG I've SOMEwhat recovered from my day. A lotta hours on my feet, on hardwood floor. Anyhow, I'm not sure I've got all oars in the water. But I will take a stab at your question.
1. The verses I quoted from Revelation. Somehow they make me think that the dead don't have bodies. And yet... I'm still chewing on that one.
2. The Ecclesiastes 12:7 verse.
3. The James 2:26 verse.
4. Also, there's the notion that BC, some things were different, even concerning the dead. AD, seems to be better or more defined. And then there's that OT concept of being "gathered to your fathers." I really like that idea, because I never knew any of my grandparents, except one grandfather. And he died when I was 3. I don't remember him at all. I remember his funeral. I've always felt a connection with past generations, but the physical reality is that there is a DISconnect.
That's all I can think tonight. Is it bedtime yet???
Re: Heaven And Hell...Can You Feel It?
Posted on: 08/04/2015 12:46 AM
S - I haven't looked up the other verses. Regarding your comment as quoted above, it is correct that the deceased do not have bodies. That is, not yet! Jesus is the only one who has a body from my understanding. He is the first to have received a gloried body which He received when He was resurrected. All believers will receive theirs at the Rapture. For those who don't believe in the Rapture, they believe it will be at Jesus' second coming.
1 Thessalonians 4:16 (KJV 1900): 16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
1 Thessalonians 4:17 (KJV 1900): 17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
"Will you meet me in the middle
Will you meet me in the air"”
Re: Heaven And Hell...Can You Feel It?
Posted on: 08/04/2015 01:19 AM
Yes, KoG, and yet Mr. Moses acquired a body for the event of the Transfiguration, so that he was seen and heard by Peter, James and John. Hmmm.
Interesting that you mentioned Gerry's lyrics from SGH. This evening I watched another Revival baptism service. The overwhelming testimony of those baptized was that they were RAISED in church, but they "bowed our heads and wondered why." Man, what on earth is WRONG with the church? That is absolutely heart-breaking, that someone could be RAISED in church and never have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ, never understand His unconditional love, never have the reality of His forgiveness in operation in their lives, and never have the assurance of His constant presence!
I mean, these people who had been RAISED in church, got hot and heavy into drugs, including heroin. One young mother was HIV positive! But she started attending revival meetings, God touched her, she went to her doctor and had tests done and NO HIV!! Absolutely not a trace of it! She, her young son and her mother were all baptized the same night! Now something like that makes you sit up and pay REAL close attention, eh?
Yes, S, that probably occurs more than we think. John Davidson, who I mentioned just the other day, is a prime example. Surely, he will be held more accountable for having heard the gospel and rejecting it than to have never heard.
Miracles do indeed happen. I believe in them. I doubt that this one is real, But It Would Be Awesome If It Were. I bet he was on his way to buy some winning lotto tickets! Or, should have after having been struck twice.
Edited by King_of_Glass on 08/04/2015 08:32 PM
Re: Heaven And Hell...Can You Feel It?
Posted on: 08/04/2015 09:02 PM
S - What else is questionable for you along the lines of the topic we have been discussing? You mentioned Ecclesiastes 12:7 verse and James 2:26 verse, but you didn't say what specifically is unclear to you.
Here's another question for you: Will we have reproductive organs in heaven with our new bodies and why or why not?
Re: Heaven And Hell...Can You Feel It?
Posted on: 08/04/2015 09:54 PM
Good EEEEfening, KoG. I have been busy learning how to use my new sewing machine. Learning is an interesting process with age. Things just don't click in like they used to. It was SO easy as a kid!
Anyhow, I haven't done a thing on the topic. Sorry. I lost yesterday and had to get some things done today, in preparation for the rest of the week. Then the sewing machine... What I need to do is sit down and READ. Perhaps after that I'll have more questions.
As for your new question? Gooooood Grief! If we consider the fact that God made our bodies, all parts included; If we consider that God directed Adam and Eve to "be fruitful and multiply and fill the earth (that's with human beings, mind you) AND subdue it and have dominion..." over all the animals BEFORE sin entered the picture; then I would immediately say yes. In other words, sexual intercourse and necessary body parts did not arrive on the scene AFTER sin entered the picture, but BEFORE. It/they were ordained from the beginning. To support that notion, look at Genesis 2:24, 25, "Therefore a man shall leave his father and his mother and shall become united and cleave to his wife, and they shall become one flesh." That only occurs through sexual intercourse. Then, "And the man and his wife were both naked and were not embarrassed or ashamed in each other's presence." Not a stitch on and nudity was not a problem - until sin entered the picture. Since then, down through the ages, we've gone to great lengths to create contraptions to cover ourselves up! We also know that AFTER sin occurred, women would be constrained to bearing children accompanied by pain. Apparently that was NOT the design!
However, here comes that monkeywrench! Jesus said, "For in the resurrected state neither do men marry nor are women given in marriage, but they are like the angels in heaven." So, do angels have reproductive organs or no? They don't reproduce. Hmmm.
You're asking a question I haven't thought about. I just assumed yes. What's YOUR conclusion and why??? DEFEND THYSELF!!!
By the way, if the current question causes some people to be uneasy, the best and most complete sex education in existence is in the church! God, as I said, created our bodies, according to His good pleasure and He intends for US to appreciate and have pleasure - according to His rules. If I go out and put motor oil in my gas tank, contrary to the manufacturer's design, I'm asking for trouble! Same with sex; go against the Manufacturer's design and reap the consequences.
Re: Heaven And Hell...Can You Feel It?
Posted on: 08/04/2015 11:05 PM
S - Your quote above, I believe, gives us the closest answer. However, there seems not to be any definitive answer, but only one that we can surmise.
Luke 20:34-36 NIV
Jesus replied, “The people of this age marry and are given in marriage. But those who are considered worthy of taking part in the age to come and in the resurrection from the dead will neither marry nor be given in marriage, and they can no longer die; for they are like the angels. They are God’s children, since they are children of the resurrection.
AND
Matthew 22:23-33
"On that day some Sadducees (who say there is no resurrection) came to Jesus and questioned Him, 24 asking, “Teacher, Moses said, ‘If a man dies having no children, his brother as next of kin shall marry his wife, and raise up children for his brother.’ 25 “Now there were seven brothers with us; and the first married and died, and having no children left his wife to his brother; 26 so also the second, and the third, down to the seventh. 27 “Last of all, the woman died. 28 “In the resurrection, therefore, whose wife of the seven will she be? For they all had married her.” 29 But Jesus answered and said to them, “You are mistaken, not understanding the Scriptures nor the power of God. 30 “For in the resurrection they neither marry nor are given in marriage, but are like angels in heaven."
As with your friend who died and went to heaven but had to return to earth, I have read about others who have experienced the same thing. Some remarked that they had no reproductive organs. To me it makes sense based on what the Scriptures seem to indicate.
Edited by King_of_Glass on 08/04/2015 11:10 PM
Re: Heaven And Hell...Can You Feel It?
Posted on: 08/05/2015 11:29 AM
Morning KoG. Can't say it's "good." Something was going on in the neighborhood most of the night and I was highly agitated. Didn't sleep well. Was awakened early and here I am.
Ross never said anything about ANY part of his body, while he was visiting and very much enjoying heaven. However, I can say that his experiences there didn't do any harm. Within a year, their 3rd son was conceived. He's a fine young man, working on a Ph.D. in history at my alma mater, has gone on one missions trip to Nepal after the earthquake, and he donated a kidney to his older brother, who has a prison ministry as well as a ministry to Hispanic aliens. Ross himself has gone on mission trips to Finland and Brazil. Mom is a wonderful watercolor artist and a real prayer warrior. Later. Gotta go to work.
Re: Heaven And Hell...Can You Feel It?
Posted on: 08/07/2015 05:45 PM
That is brotherly love...the kidney donation!
Here is an INTERESTING YOUTUBE VIDEO related to the topic at hand. No pun intended! At first, I thought the guy on our right was answering incorrectly, but towards the end, he was in agreement with my line of thinking.
Re: Heaven And Hell...Can You Feel It?
Posted on: 08/07/2015 11:28 PM
Hi KoG. Indeed, that is a very interesting video. I find it helpful to gel all the swirling thoughts I have on the subject. I should watch it again.
I also watched the one on divorce and the one on remarriage. Very interesting points, emphasizing God's desire for reconciliation and restoration, no matter the reason for the divorce. Bottom line: divorce is due to sin. We've got the WAY to work through sin, get over it, receive healing, forgiveness, restoration to right relationships. The WAY is a Person and His name is Jesus.
I love the way they spell out God's desire for people and for married couples in particular. The old saying goes, "It takes two to tango." Well, I add on, "And it takes two to UNtango." We can't control the other person, but we can control our reactions. For our own self-interests, as well as those around us, we MUST!
Re: Heaven And Hell...Can You Feel It?
Posted on: 08/30/2015 02:38 AM
S - I can't remember which subject thread it was where you commented about caskets interfering with the natural process of the body returning to the earth. I thought of you when I came across THIS VIDEO.
Re: Heaven And Hell...Can You Feel It?
Posted on: 08/30/2015 01:53 PM
Now THIS is utterly fascinating! Before I could stop the thing, I zipped right on to another video, which leads me to believe that there's a worldwide effort going on to render caskets "eco-friendly!"
The BIG problem that I see is centuries of doing things...well, the way we've done things. People moved into a new region and huddled together, mostly for protection from wild animals and oftentimes from marauding tribes. I understand that. But the problem is that NOW we've got these colossal cities, filled with buildings piled on top of each other, which just happen to be filled with people.
Worse, people built their churches, with the congregational cemetery attached, in the center of their towns, oftentimes on a hill. Now I understand the symbolism; make God the center of your life. That's a good thing.
I've never experienced this, but was told in Europe that there is a problem with decomposing caskets and bodies (placed in over-crowded cemeteries) getting into the water supply, and also if the wind is right, you can smell the smells!
So, on 21st century Earth, we've got all these over-crowded cemeteries filled with decomposing caskets and corpses, that are too close to people's homes and we're running out of room to put more!
Without leveling our cities and decreasing the population density to where we can spread out our burial grounds, I don't know how we can suddenly switch to eco-friendly caskets, that will just increase decay and therefore, increase the smell! I think we're STUCK!
Cremation helps reduce the amount of "waste" if I dare use such a word to refer to Grandma, Dad or Sweetie. Some people can't handle that, thinking they have to have BONES in order for their bodies to be resurrected! If God is God, nothing is to difficult for Him! Some families can't handle cremating Grandma, Dad or Sweetie, finding it difficult to let go. I understand that. Losing a loved one is very hard.
Unless we designated unused lands, such as deserts or maybe the moon, as burial grounds, I don't see a solution. And people like to go to the cemetery where their loved ones are buried to place fresh flowers, remember the person, showing respect. If we send all our dead to the moon, that eliminates the option!
Well, one day the WHOLE thing will be properly dealt with. No more death. No more graves!!!
Re: Heaven And Hell...Can You Feel It?
Posted on: 08/30/2015 06:20 PM
S - What is your personal burial preference? By that I mean what is to be done with your remains? You and I are very much in the same situation. No spouse and no children. I told my siblings (2 brothers and 2 sisters) that my preference is to be buried in a cemetery, but it truly doesn't matter to me. My eldest of the two brothers (who will most likely be the one in charge) said if it doesn't really matter than I will be cremated. I am fine by that. After all as you indicated, remains aren't needed by God for the resurrection of the body. My hope, however, is that the rapture of believers will be occurring soon so it's a moot discussion.
I viewed a video on YouTube that showed a military serviceman's grave being disinterred to check to see if it was actually his remains buried in the grave marked as his. It was being done because of other cases where the wrong remains were being buried in the Arlington National Cemetery especially those of servicemen of recent years. It was sad. When they lifted the casket out of the grave, the lid bent and a large amount of water came pouring out of one end of it. It was especially sad because it was being done in the presence of family members who had to witness the damage to the casket and the water pouring out. You could hear their tearful reaction. It is said that it's not that uncommon for a casket to accumulate water especially in parts of the country that get a lot of moisture. Even with a burial vault it occurs.
Re: Heaven And Hell...Can You Feel It?
Posted on: 08/30/2015 10:52 PM
Me? I wanna be cremated. My father decided to have my mother cremated, which shocked Aunt Dorothy! But my cousins liked the idea so much, 2 months later when their mother died, they had her cremated also. Aunt Dorothy didn't like that either! She gave her kids strict orders that she was to be buried. Period.
Not only do I want to be cremated, but I want my "ashes" scattered on top of Glory Hole #1 Mountain! Nobody but family knows where that is, and my best friend, because she helped me haul my dog's ashes up there.
In all honesty, if I die before Jesus returns, I'm not gonna care what others do with my body. It isn't me and it will never be me! It's just the shell I walk around in. People recognize me by the shell, but it isn't who I am.
It's not legal to scatter ashes anymore in California. It wasn't when my mother died in 1984. But the mortician explained it's because people have been careless, dumping the whole BOX of ashes out of airplanes, landing on people's heads down below, or not removing the metal ID tag before scattering the ashes and people have been hit by the ID tag and then used it to go after the family. So I've got the ID tags here and I hand-scattered my parents' and my dog's ashes.
But being single does present us with some innersting situations, doesn't it? I'm tempted when asked who I want contacted in case of emergency to either leave it blank or say, "God!" Freak 'em out. I've read that many people in our generation are moving into homes together - just so they can take care of each other! I don't mean shacking up together either. I mean several people moving into a place, to share rent, responsibilities and care for each other. The "wave" of the future!
We have a serious problem here with our very nice cemetery: sunken graves! A good part of the town is built on a swamp and things sink, including graves in the cemetery. Sometimes they have to exhume a person and move him elsewhere. Sometimes they stack 'em up, especially with spouses or family members.
Cremation and prudently scattering the ashes is the solution. No person is going to dig up my parents and dog. My father chose cremation, by the way, and he chose Glory Hole #1 Mountain as his final resting place because he didn't want "some hippie peeing on his ashes up on Mt. Shasta." Leave it to my father to think of such a thing!
Re: Heaven And Hell...Can You Feel It?
Posted on: 08/31/2015 12:58 AM
S - I googled "Glory Hole #1"; however, I failed to maintain the space between "glory" and "hole" which was a major problem...believe you me!!! It scared me for a minute at the thought that you wanted your ashes scattered there. But, fortunately, I found the mistake that I had made. Shewwww!
Re: Heaven And Hell...Can You Feel It?
Posted on: 08/31/2015 01:29 AM
But I SAID nobody knows where Glory Hole #1 is, except family and my best friend - if she remembers! It's not the real name of the place. One of my uncles named it, because the deer hunting was very good there! We had Glory Hole #2 also. But in all honesty, I'm not sure I could find it. Then there was the Spring, and Camp, Spur #1 Road, etc.
Re: Heaven And Hell...Can You Feel It?
Posted on: 08/31/2015 12:31 PM
Oops! Now I see why you came unglued! Who'd a-thunk that term was porno? I mean, good grief! Life IS more than sex, after all! And by the way, I just saw the search results, from what you said you typed. I didn't GO to any of them. I have YET to SEE a porno site and I don't intend on seeing one!
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